Summary
Overview
Dr. Kelly McGonigal, a Stanford psychologist and author, joins the Armchair Expert to discuss her new book on joy. The conversation explores why joy is often difficult for people to embrace, the neuroscience behind joyful moments, and how actively seeking small uplifts can be transformative. They discuss joy dampening, collective joy, positive empathy, and the importance of meeting others' happiness with enthusiasm rather than cynicism. The episode also delves into McGonigal's background, her meditation practice, and her research on compassion and stress.
Introduction and Background
Dax and Monica welcome Dr. Kelly McGonigal and discuss her impressive credentials as a Stanford psychologist and bestselling author. They joke about her Harry Potter-esque name and clear up that while she lectures at Stanford, she's not technically a professor. The conversation touches on her New Jersey upbringing, her identical twin sister who is a game designer and futurist, and how their minds work differently despite being genetically identical.
- Kelly McGonigal has written several books including The Willpower Instinct, The Upside of Stress, The Joy of Movement, and her new book Joy is a Risk Worth Taking
- Her name resembles Professor McGonagall from Harry Potter, leading to comparisons by Monica's daughter
- Kelly has an identical twin sister who is a game designer and futurist who created alternate reality games, including simulating a respiratory pandemic in 2008
- They are mirror twins - Kelly is left-handed, her sister is right-handed, and they even have mirrored moles
" I have always been so curious about what it's like to be another person. I just think all the time, what's it like to be in somebody else's head? What are people feeling? What are people thinking? "
Childhood and Path to Psychology
Kelly describes her strict yet paradoxical upbringing where her parents were highly controlling about some things but left her and her sister to their own devices in other ways. Despite being restricted from crossing the street or going on school trips, they had complete freedom with media and were expected to excel academically without oversight. This unusual combination shaped her interest in understanding human behavior and led her to study psychology at Boston University and eventually Stanford.
- Kelly's parents were very strict in certain ways but also left the twins completely alone, creating a contradictory childhood experience
- They weren't allowed to cross the street or go on the senior trip, but could watch anything on TV and read any books
- The expectation was nothing but straight A's and top scores, but there was no parental oversight or help with homework
- Kelly did research with psychopaths as an undergraduate, administering psychological tests and studying their responses
" My parents thought I was highly corruptible. So they definitely thought I would be a bit of a bad girl if I were allowed out of the house. "
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