Summary
Overview
Sam Harris speaks with Anne Applebaum about how American foreign policy under Trump has transformed into an instrument of corruption and revolutionary change. They discuss the ideological agenda to dismantle traditional institutions, the support for far-right movements in Europe, the complex dynamics around European rearmament, and the current state of the war in Ukraine. Applebaum argues that a coalition of ideologues, tech companies, and cryptocurrency interests are working together to reshape global politics while profiting from the chaos.
The Revolutionary Nature of Trump's Foreign Policy
Applebaum explains how Trump's administration represents a revolutionary project aimed at destroying existing institutions and replacing them with business people and ideologues rather than diplomats and experts. This isn't just about Trump's narcissism but about a coordinated effort by people around him to fundamentally reshape how America operates on the world stage. She emphasizes that this revolution has both ideological components and opportunistic profiteers taking advantage of the vacuum created by dismantling traditional diplomatic channels.
- There is a team of people around Trump pursuing a revolutionary project to destroy existing institutions and replace them with themselves
- They are clearing away diplomacy, removing experts, and substituting business people and friends of the president
- Different kinds of ideologues are involved: white supremacists, Christian nationalists who want to replace the secular state, and people wanting to destroy the administrative state
- People are taking advantage of the vacuum to make money, creating patterns of corruption across Canada, Latin America, Europe, and Asia
" there is a group of people around him who are very happy to destroy existing institutions and bureaucracies and customs and to replace them with themselves, essentially. "
" when you have a revolution, there's always an ideological component, right? There's a big idea. And then the people bearing the big idea knock things down. But then lots of other people come in after them and alongside them. "
The Alliance of Ideology, Tech, and Crypto Supporting the Far Right
Applebaum reveals a coordinated effort between ideologues, tech companies, and cryptocurrency interests to support far-right parties across Europe. These parties oppose regulation, making them natural allies for companies that want to operate without oversight. The Trump administration is building closer relationships with opposition parties in Europe—specifically far-right movements—rather than with existing governments, representing a dramatic departure from traditional American foreign policy.
- The Trump administration has people building ties with the far right in Europe who care about 'European civilization'
- Far-right parties oppose regulation, attracting support from cryptocurrency and tech companies that don't want to be regulated
- This coalition of ideologues, tech, and crypto is working together to support parties like the AFD in Germany and far right movements in France, Poland, and Romania
- The administration has closer relations with opposition parties in Europe than with the governments themselves
" supporting far right political movements in Europe in order to overthrow existing governments, in order maybe to take apart the European Union, which is seen by some American companies as a hassle. This is a new way of operating on the world stage. "
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