Summary
Overview
In this wrap-up episode from their extensive US tour, Konstantin Kisin and Francis Foster reflect on recording 33 interviews across four cities. They discuss their groundbreaking conversation with Dave Smith that modeled constructive political disagreement, address the backlash from their Ben Shapiro interview, and share insights from conversations with figures ranging from Sam Harris to Hassan Paika. The hosts explore deeper themes including the dangers of rage-farming in new media, the crisis facing young men, the threat of socialism, and the transformative power of maintaining optimism and building rather than destroying. They emphasize the importance of free speech culture and taking personal responsibility in the age of AI and information overload.
The Dave Smith Conversation: Modeling Constructive Disagreement
The hosts celebrate their recent three-hour conversation with libertarian comedian Dave Smith as a rare example of people with strong political disagreements having a genuine, good-faith discussion. They contrast this with both old-style mainstream media gotcha interviews and new media's tendency to either avoid challenging guests or turn conversations into performative debates. The discussion highlights how Dave's approach enabled a meaningful exchange that demonstrated the humanity on both sides of political divides.
- When was the last time you saw people who strongly disagree have a genuine 2-3 hour conversation on YouTube
- Mainstream media used Cathy Newman-style misrepresentation interviews, while new media morphed into either unchallenged softball conversations or fake debate performances
- Dave Smith deserves credit for not treating the conversation as a debate he needed to win, enabling the hosts to conduct themselves authentically
- The approach models how debates used to look - mutual respect while arguing points and acknowledging the other person is simply wrong
" When was the last time you saw people who strongly disagree about political issues have that kind of conversation on YouTube, on a podcast? When was the last time you saw that? "
" We don't see it anymore. And that is the real, that is the beautiful thing about the conversation, but there's also a sad element to it which is we've lost that ability "
The Ben Shapiro Backlash: New Media's Descent into Old Tricks
The hosts discuss how anonymous rage farmers on Twitter clipped Ben Shapiro completely out of context from their recent interview, misrepresenting his statements to mobilize their tribe and generate engagement. They draw parallels between this behavior and the dishonest tactics of mainstream media that new media was supposed to replace. This incident becomes a case study in how the new media space is becoming deranged, with people choosing tribal loyalty and monetization over truth.
- One anonymous rage farmer clipped Ben Shapiro out of context, completely misrepresenting what he was saying to make him appear to say something he absolutely wasn't
- What these people did to Ben is exactly what mainstream media used to do to people it hated
- Everyone in new media screams that mainstream media has no standards while having none of their own
- The gatekeepers are gone, meaning consumers now have ultimate responsibility as gatekeepers to their own minds
" It's so much easier to pull something down, to break something, than it is to build something up, to create something, to be of genuine worth. "
" What these people tried to do to Ben is exactly what the mainstream media used to do to people that it hated. "
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