Summary
Overview
Stephen Dubner interviews Steve Levitt about the final episode of People I Mostly Admire after five years. They discuss Levitt's evolution as an interviewer, his new educational venture called the Levitt Lab, and his plans to occasionally guest host Freakonomics Radio. The conversation explores Levitt's spiritual experiences, his views on AI in education, and memorable moments from his podcast.
The End of People I Mostly Admire and New Beginnings
Levitt announces the end of People I Mostly Admire after five years, but reveals he'll be guest hosting Freakonomics Radio episodes going forward. The show's entire archive will be republished from the beginning. Despite running out of time rather than admiration for potential guests, Levitt reflects on how the podcast transformed him from someone who rarely read books to an avid consumer of ideas, though the weekly schedule was grueling.
- People I Mostly Admire is ending after five years, with the archive being republished from the beginning
- Levitt will occasionally guest host Freakonomics Radio episodes
- Joel Osteen remains at the top of Levitt's wishlist of guests he couldn't book
- The podcast facilitated Levitt's pivot from creating knowledge to consuming ideas
- Levitt read only about 30 books in 20 years before the podcast, mostly young adult fiction
" I always thought it would get easier and easier to get people to come to the podcast. That's because my own rule when I'm asked to come on a podcast is I look at who's been on it before, and if they're way more interesting and important than I am, then I go, I better do it, because those people know better than me. I believe in markets. So I thought as we got this list, it got more and more impressive. Everyone would just come, but they don't. "
Spiritual Awakening and the Universe
Levitt opens up about his surprising spiritual experiences, including attending Joel Osteen's service and a transformative month-long trip to India with his wife Suzanne. He reveals how he substitutes 'universe' for 'God' in religious contexts and describes a Buddhist-like awakening where he stopped striving for outcomes and found peace. Despite being a rationalist scientist, Levitt has become increasingly open to spiritual concepts as he's aged.
- Levitt's wife took him to see Joel Osteen preach as a birthday surprise in Houston's Compact Center
- Levitt substitutes 'universe' for 'Jesus' and 'God' when listening to Osteen's sermons
- During a month in India without phones, Levitt experienced a spiritual awakening after two miserable weeks
- The awakening came from realizing indifference to outcomes made everything equally valuable
- Levitt has become much more open-minded about spirituality with age, despite being a rationalist
" I think some of the nicest and best and most interesting people I know just have a faith in the universe and believe in stuff that's a little bit out there. "
" suddenly I just opened up to a kind of friendliness with the universe and everything was good and I was peaceful and it lasted for months after I came back and every once in a while I can tap into it again "
" I think as a kid, I was willing to listen to my mom's very odd takes on the world. And I didn't really believe it. But as I got older and older, I've seen enough evidence. No, the power of placebo. "
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