Summary
Overview
Stephen Dubner interviews Hilary Sterling, executive chef at Chisiamo in New York City, in this episode of Better in Person. Sterling shares her unconventional journey from eating processed food as a child to becoming a celebrated chef devoted to Italian cuisine. The conversation covers her philosophy of cooking with senses over strict measurements, the brutal economics of running a restaurant, her negotiation tactics, and why she turned down a prestigious job offer. Sterling also cooks for Dubner, who returns the favor with a fish stew that spectacularly fails to please her soup-averse palate.
Introduction and Fire-Starting at Chisiamo
Dubner visits Hilary Sterling's kitchen at Chisiamo, where she immediately hands him a blowtorch to light the wood-fired oven. Sterling shows off her burn scars, each one a memory from her cooking career, including a 2003 incident at Mesa Grill when she tried to be polite to a coworker and paid the price. She demonstrates making cacio e pepe two ways and teaches Dubner to listen to pasta cooking, emphasizing the importance of using all senses in the kitchen.
- Sterling has burn scars from her career, remembering each one including a 2003 oven burn at Mesa Grill
- She teaches cooks to make pasta with their eyes closed, using their senses rather than just sight
- In a taste test, Dubner prefers the dried pasta cacio e pepe over the fresh version
" No, if you have burns, that means you're not paying attention. "
" Stop being so polite. "
The Fish Stew Debacle
Dubner attempts to return Sterling's hospitality by making her a fish stew from scratch, only to discover she hates soup and has texture issues stemming from her childhood. Sterling reveals her mother fed her mushy foods like cream cheese sandwiches on Wonder Bread and canned potatoes, which influenced her aversion to certain textures. Despite Dubner's efforts with his homemade stew, Sterling manages only a few bites, creating an awkward but humorous moment.
- Sterling has a strong aversion to soup, which Dubner discovers only after making her fish stew
- She grew up eating processed, mushy food including cream cheese sandwiches and canned potatoes
- Sterling's childhood diet of texture-less food is why she became a chef focused on proper techniques
- Dubner used 'fish cubes' from Fresh Direct, which Sterling found horrifying
" That's why I'm a chef. "
" My mom named me after her aunt Gene but it turns out the cat's name was Gene and her name was Mini. "
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